[00:04] Jennifer Wu: Hello everyone, thanks for listening to The Founder Spirit Podcast. I'm your host, Jennifer Wu.  In this podcast series, I interview exceptional individuals from all over the world with the Founder Spirit, ranging from social entrepreneurs, tech founders, to philanthropists, elite athletes, and more. Together, we'll uncover not only how they manage to succeed in face of multiple challenges, but also who they are as people and their human story.

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“One day I feel like I'm not happy, I want to kill myself. Then the blessing from the old monk, I received a blessing from him every morning. Out of nowhere in that existential crisis in my life, his blessing calmed my mind. I know later that it’s called wisdom from (the) silent mind - when my mind is calm and peaceful, the wisdom comes.” 

“Inside everyone, there's a Buddha nature. Some people might call that Holy Spirit, or now science calls it pure consciousness that triggers the chains in the brain - but it (is) the inner sun shining for all, like the outer sun. So I think that's the most important lesson I learned from my teacher - less is more. And keep things simple and profound and touch that Buddha nature inside, it (will) change your life tremendously in a wholesome way.”

Joining us today is the Venerable Burin Thitakusalo or Monk Burin, Executive Director of The Middle Way Meditation Institute, a New York-based global non-profit educational organization that converges timeless wisdom and evidence-based science to tackle key problems facing humanity. 

Ordained as a Buddhist monk in Thailand since 2000, Venerable Burin's quest is to provide holistic and cutting edge solutions for people of all ages, races, religions and no religion to achieve sustainability leading to global happiness. He also pioneered “The Middle Way Education”, a groundbreaking curriculum, modernizing ancient wisdom into simple and practical tools to help individuals cultivate the Middle Way lifestyle, consisting of having a healthy body, a caring heart, an intelligent mind, and (an) enlightened spirit. 

Having taught in over 30 countries across six continents, Monk Burin has worked tirelessly over two decades to deliver the profound wisdom of Buddhist teaching in the most engaging and practical way to impact personal growth and societal change. His “World Peace Through Inner Peace” projects have resulted in two Guinness World Records and touched people from all walks of life.

Author of the book “Inner Peace, a Buddha’s Guide to Happiness, Success and World Peace”, Monk Burin has lectured at Harvard Business School and works with the Sustainable Development Solutions Network, a global initiative for the United Nations to research “The Middle Way Education”.

How can Buddha’s teachings impact personal growth and societal change? Well, let’s talk to Monk Burin and find out.

Hello, Venerable Burin, and welcome to the Founder Spirit Podcast. It's so great to have you with us today and thank you for taking the time. 

[03:45] Monk Burin: Thank you. Hello, Jennifer, so nice to be here. 

[03:48] Jennifer: Growing up in Thailand, what were some of your formative experiences? 

[03:54] Monk: I grew up in the neighboring towns of Bangkok, and my family actually ran a restaurant business. Since I was young, (I was) running around in the restaurant helping my mom and dad doing different things. So I learned to cooperate and work with several people that come to the restaurant. 

[04:16] Jennifer: You talked about your mother giving rice to monks, I guess it's helpful when she runs a restaurant business. 

[04:23] Monk: In Thailand, Buddhism is the major religion. Every morning there'll be monks passing by the restaurant, so my mom liked to teach me giving. 

So she’d wake me up in the morning, early for a young kid, to put rice in the bowl of the monk. And I’d receive the blessing from the monk. And I think that resonated with me about goodness since I was young. I didn't know how much it will be needed in the future, but my mom planned that seed of goodness in a young mind. 

[04:55] Jennifer: You had previously mentioned about being a perfectionist and always wanting to be number one in school. How did that mindset influence you in becoming a monk later? 

[05:06] Monk: That mindset about perfectionist, I think it's quite common. Right now, I live in New York, there are a lot of perfectionists out here. And I hope some realization will make people know what is true happiness.

When I was young, I didn't understand Buddhism truly. I read so many books like “How to Win Friends and Influence People” (by) Dale Carnegie, “Think and Grow Rich” (by) Napoleon Hill. I'm drawn toward how to be successful, and I liked to be number one always since I was young. 

And because of that, I started to accumulate stress. I have my migraine, it's very scary - my hair started to turn white as a teenager, because I think a lot, I think all the time and I want to be number one, chasing, chasing. And it (drove) me to the point that I don't want to live in this world. Because when I fail, when I feel like, oh, who took number one? What (did) they do better than me? 

So with that confrontation, with sufferings - nothing from my mom, nothing from my dad, just from my own mind that I want to be number one, to be perfect. And I carry that migraine inside (of) me. I feel like I should be successful, perfect and no migraine. But I realized later that to be successful without Dharma, without wisdom, you're killing yourself. Perfectionists die young - that's what people say. 

One day I feel like I'm not happy, I want to kill myself. Then the blessing from the old monk, I received a blessing from him every morning. Out of nowhere in that existential crisis in my life, his blessing calmed my mind. I know later that it’s called wisdom from (the) silent mind - when my mind is calm and peaceful, the wisdom comes. 

I achieved everything - I became number one in my class, I'm a singer, I have a beautiful girlfriend, I win all the sports, I'm the top scorer in the soccer game, the tournament. I have everything, but I don't have peace of mind - I cannot sleep peacefully, thirsty for more success.

The following day, after that crisis moment, I walked back to the bookstore near Thammasat University and I walked into the spirituality section to find the answer. Where is my happiness and what peace of mind can bring me to true happiness? 

And I realized later, I need to learn the best by becoming a monk, following the Buddha to truly understand. Because Buddha said, “peace of mind surpasses all kinds of happiness”. And that pushed me to the monastic experience. During my university summer, I became a monk for the first time. 

[07:56] Jennifer: And also when you were younger, you wanted to be a TV journalist, as I understand. And that's why you chose to study mass communications and English at university. When did you exactly realize that the monastic life is your calling? Was there ever an ‘aha’ moment for you in the whole journey? 

[08:19] Monk: Yes, there is. I would say that (I) accidentally became a Buddhist monk because when I grew up, I was not groomed to be a monk. I learned mass communication, my goal is to work at CNN. But suffering, (as) we say dukkha in Pali, it really caused me to think about monks’ life. 

And at first, I didn't plan to be a monk (for) this long. I wanted to stop my migraine, and become more intelligent, more sharp, and pay gratitude to my mom and dad. But during that summertime, I realized that, wow, everything I read, everything I learned about (how) to become successful and rich is not equal to happiness. And I learned from the Buddha that if you want to be happy, think good thoughts, speak good words, (and) do good actions. It's so simple, (but) it's so challenging to do in the modern day. 

So I dropped my education for one year, stayed in the temple. In that one year in the temple, I meditated more, I learned more, and I got to a very deep state of meditation. As a monk, we cannot elaborate too much about it, but it made me realize that wow, in this physical body, there's something called Buddha nature - something so powerful. 

That's how Prince Siddharta (Buddha) goes out from the palace and becomes a teacher and helps other people. So in that deep state of meditation, I realized that my life, my energy can help this world more if I'm a monk, not a journalist. That's (the) turning point. 

After that one year, I finished my bachelor (degree). At 22, that's my second ordination. 

[10:02] Jennifer: Wow, that's a beautiful story. And you had mentioned that you were a top athlete, you had a beautiful girlfriend, you were also a singer in a band. So what was the hardest thing that you had to give up in this worldly life to become a monk? Was it the girlfriend? 

[10:21] Monk: During my one year at the temple, I already set my goals in life very clearly - become a monk, that’s the best thing for myself, for my family and the world. 

I really wanted my family to understand, and I hoped my girlfriend (would) support (me). And they (were) not 100% (in) the first year. After a few years, they fully supported (me). But I think that's my challenge in that year. (chuckles)

[10:45] Jennifer: And your master, what was the most significant lesson that he taught you? 

[10:53] Monk: He taught me that less is more - it's simple, but it's very deep. How (can) less become more? He taught me that to be truly happy and peaceful, we need to let go (of) what is unnecessary in life.

One day we need to say goodbye to everything, we need to say goodbye to everyone. No one escapes this, including (the) Buddha himself. So it's not the house, it's not the car, it's not the title; it’s the name that people remember. And the name that people remember is that you do something good for others - you are in the memory of many people. Like Buddha, he passed away more than 2,000 years ago, but I still hear his name very often. 

I just came back from a conference about wellbeing, and the main coordinator of the program, he said, I think the next Buddha is the community. Yeah, he used the term the next Buddha is a community, not a person. And I totally agree, because my teacher taught me that also, that inside everyone, there's a Buddha nature. Some people might call that Holy Spirit, or now science calls it pure consciousness that triggers the chains in the brain - but it (is) the inner sun shining for all, like the outer sun.

So I think that's the most important lesson I learned from my teacher - less is more. And keep things simple and profound and touch that Buddha nature inside, it (will) change your life tremendously in a wholesome way. 

[12:26] Jennifer: keep that in mind, less is more. 

[12:28] Monk: Yeah, we (are) in a society that more is more.  

[12:31] Jennifer: Well, more begets more because the more you have, the more you want. You always think, oh, what do I not have? So it's never enough, in a way. 

[12:40] Monk: never stop.

[12:41] Jennifer: I wanted to ask you some questions about Buddhism. There's the three jewels in Buddhism - the Buddha, the Dharma, and the Sangha. 

Buddha is obviously the awakened one, the one that attained enlightenment. Dharma is the teaching of the Buddha, so the path to enlightenment. And then, Sangha is the community of the Buddhists, potentially the community that will be the next Buddha, it's a place of learning, and it's a place of support. 

But what are the five precepts of Buddhism? 

[13:14] Monk:  To put it in perspective, to live a good life, Buddha talked about a thing called three-fold training. The first one is discipline, sometimes we use (the) term precept also; meditation (is) step number two, and then wisdom is number three. In Pali, we use terms Sila (“discipline or precept”), Samadhi (“meditation”), Prajna (“wisdom”). 

Sila or precept is the foundation for good meditation, and good meditation is the foundation for good wisdom. I really want to show this complete Buddhism, because sometimes in the west, you learn selective Buddhism. Like, I meditate, but I'm not happy. No, you need to have good Sila. So five Sila or five precepts is very key in the path of happiness. 

Number one, not to kill human, animal, any kind, even the small mosquito. You find a way to get them somewhere else, but not kill them. Because when you kill, you get into (an) angry cycle. You know, it's a habit thing - we train ourselves not to get into that angry cycle. 

And then the second one, not to steal. If we control our greed, we tame ourselves. Number three, not commit adultery. And number four, not use false speech - lying, divisive speech, harsh speech, gossiping - not good for meditation, it distracts the mind. 

And the last one, I think there's a most challenging one in the west, not to take intoxicants. When you're drunk, your mindfulness levels go down and you have more risk to break number one, number two, number three, number four. 

The five precepts, in short, is a good foundation for meditation, lead to wisdom. 

[15:06] Jennifer: So, number four, to abstain from false speech, then we should never go on Twitter or X. 

[15:13] Monk: It'll be very really challenging, I don't use Twitter too much, I'm a bit scared of using it. 

[15:20] Jennifer: I think you get sucked in. It's like an intoxicant, you get addicted and it clouds your mind (chuckles). 

[15:27] Monk: As a monk, I would say that I have a bit of struggle (with) how to use social media, like how I use it and not let them use me. (I) need to be very mindful to be able to do that. 

[15:39] Jennifer: So the five precepts are like the ten commitments in the Western religion sense? 

[15:44] Monk: I think some details are very similar, but the precepts, this is the guideline, and you make a decision by yourself. 

Buddha used to say, I'm one of the people who still suffer; I'm like you, (a) human, but I practice, I find enlightenment. I found the way, but you must walk by yourself. I'm your guide - I can show you the way, but you must walk by yourself. 

So that's how Buddha approached Dharma or (the) teaching. So in the precepts, it's more about you and that truth, nothing else. And then you work with it. If it works, you continue. (If) it doesn't work, try something different - very humanistic. 

[16:27] Jennifer: I do have a friend, and she wanted me to ask you, is it okay to have just a glass of wine to relax at the end of the day? 

[16:35] Monk: (chuckle) I will explain that anything Buddha said is a guideline and you walk by yourself. You can set yourself free and you can find something else to enjoy and relax at the end of the day. 

[16:50] Jennifer: Maybe meditation…

[16:51] Monk: Yeah, meditation, relax and walk on the beach, see the sunshine. No alcohol in the sunshine. 

[16:59] Jennifer: That's right. I want to switch a little bit and talk about the Middle Way Meditation Institute. 

The Middle Way retreat first started in Thailand in 2006, and then the Middle Way Meditation Institute became an official organization in 2013. So what was the idea to set up MMI, an NGO to promote world peace through inner peace. I mean, as a monk, why set up a separate NGO? 

[17:30] Monk: I think the way it happened is interesting because it's similar to how I became a monk, that I didn't set the goal to be a monk, to travel the world. So The Middle Way Institute started from (a) very interesting interaction.

When I became a monk, I taught students from all over the world. They fly in from almost 100 countries, most of them (are) not Buddhists. There's a group of Catholics, medical doctors from the Philippines, (who) come to Thailand and learn with me. And they feel like, wow, I'm not teaching religion, I'm teaching how to become a better person, actually, in general. 

They said, Monk Burin, can you come to the Philippines and teach my fellow Catholic friends? And that doctor even talked to the bishop in the Philippines. And it (so) happened that (the) archbishop used to come to Thailand and knew that meditation is neutral, anyone can learn it. It started from that, so I flew to the Philippines. And then my master told me, go there, work with the bishop, work with the Catholics, world peace will start from the Philippines. 

So I talked to the bishop, we talked to the mayor - they would like to organize more than 10,000 people to meditate at the same time. We needed to partner with the city, with the university, with the archdiocese there. So they said, we want to work with you, what is your organization? I said, I'm from the temple. No, we need (an) organization so we can sign (an) MOU. 

So the Middle Way Institute, originally from our teachers in Thailand, was born in the Philippines.

[19:12] Jennifer: And tell us, what is the Middle Way? What does that mean? 

[19:15] Monk: Yes, the Middle Way is very wide and very deep at the same time. If you study Buddhism, you probably (will) see the term the Middle Way. Balance, it covers everything that we do as a good Buddhist practitioner. 

But there's a depth in that which I will elaborate more. The Middle Way started in the first teaching (of) the Buddha. He said through the Middle Way, I became enlightened. And in those days, in the Buddha’s time, there (were) two extremes. One is you want to be happy, your sensual pleasure, five senses. And that's his life in the palace. And that tradition (is) still available right now in the world. 

[20:01] Jennifer: right in New York City…

[20:02] Monk: (chuckles). And the other way, it's self-tormentation. You want to be happy, you need to suffer yourself. You need to limit yourself, very ascetic, eat so little, lie down on a nail bed. It's still there in India, self-tormentation. 

Buddha tried both, and he didn't find enlightenment. Then one day, there's some angelic signal (that) came to him like a guitar. Too loose, (does) not sound nice; too tight, (does) not sound nice (either). And then just the middle, it sounds so beautiful - he found the Middle Way. 

Then in 1917, the founding teacher of the Middle Way Meditation - his name is Luang Pu Wat Paknam - he practiced Buddhism, he followed the Four Noble Truths. But full moon, September, more than 100 years ago, 1917, he made a vow to the Buddha statue at one temple in Thailand - oh, Buddha, please show me the true path to enlightenment. So that night, he meditated, and his mind settled down inside himself. And then he found the light and experienced the Buddha nature within, a very deep state. It’s about two finger widths above the navel -  in the Middle Way meditation, we call that center of the body, and that is the deep meaning of the Middle Way.

But we need to practice to really feel that when you breathe here, breathe in and breathe out, and when you set yourself free from your breathing, it's going to connect to that deep spot inside. Luang Pu Wat Paknam said that this is the true Middle Way, this is the inner path that Siddhartha became Buddha. And that's the depth of the Middle Way Meditation. 

[21:50] Jennifer: So just for some of the listeners out there that don't necessarily know the story of the Buddha, he was a prince, actually. His name is Prince Siddhartha and his parents didn't want him to experience any suffering, so he grew up in the palace, and whatever he wanted he could have. And then one night, he just left the palace life. 

You had mentioned this inner light, the Buddha nature inside. So first we need to have discipline, (it) has to do with the five precepts, and then we need to meditate. And then once we receive the inner light, then we have wisdom. How long is the path between the meditation and the wisdom? I mean, is it possible to never achieve wisdom? What if I meditate all day and I don't have wisdom? 

[22:44] Monk: No, you will (chuckles). That’s (an) answer in the scripture - a thousand years ago, people have the same curiosity, Buddha, how long is it going to take that I will attain enlightenment? 

And Buddha said, the short term is seven days, the medium one is seven months, the long one is seven years, if you continue (to) practice consistently. 

[23:09] Jennifer: That's a big range there, seven days to seven years. And I wanted to ask you, why did you move MMI to New York City? 

[23:16] Monk: I think it started when I talked to people in different parts of the world, they saw what we did in the Philippines - more than 10,000 people in the first event, the second event, 50,000 people. It became news, and then it spread, it’s called (the) “Light of Peace” event. It's (a) Guinness World Record, so many people meditated to get it. 

2017 is the centennial celebration of the Middle Way Meditation. To celebrate 100 years, I organized the event (on) six continents on the same day - full moon, September 2017. We meditated around the world, from New York to Rio Janeiro to Barcelona, Spain to Maputo, Mozambique, Africa, Iloilo, Philippine and then Sydney, Australia - six continents. 

The following year, 2018, we had another event. And then someone told me that oh, Venerable, your Middle Way education aligns so well with (the) SDGs - Sustainable Development Goals. So that professor in Sydney told me that, I must contact Professor Jeffrey Sachs, who is the key architect behind this SDG. I thought that he knew Professor Sachs, I said, please introduce me. He said, no, I didn't know him, he’s (a) famous guy in (the) UN. 

So I just googled his name - Professor Jeffrey Sachs, and then I found his email at Columbia University. So I just wrote the email, I made a wish to the master that if this will help more people, may (the) professor read it and reply to me. And he replied to me. 

So (in) June 2018, I flew to New York (to) meet Professor Sachs. And that (is) the start of the Middle Way headquarters in New York. I told my master that (the) UN (is) interested in Buddhism with SDG, Buddhism and sustainability can enhance each other. So my master said, let's move to New York, you can help more people from there. 

[25:17] Jennifer: Oh, wow. 

[25:18] Monk: miraculous… 

[25:19] Jennifer: Yeah, it's a miracle, I guess, Jeffrey Sachs, he's probably not used to replying to cold emails. 

[25:25] Monk: No, he had seven secretaries surrounding his work. And that day something magical happened. 

[25:32] Jennifer: Can you tell us about the Middle Way Education that you're promoting? I think that there's a school in Los Angeles that's piloting the curriculum. 

[25:41] Monk: Yes, we have the pilot school in Los Angeles, Tree Academy. 

I think the Middle Way Education started from my conversation with Professor Jeffrey Sachs. We agreed that in the education system, we don't have a character building curriculum. It's more on how to master mathematics, physics, but how to become (a) good person, it’s not clearly taught in the schools. 

And then he asked me what is the methodology in Buddhism? And I said, there are the four foundations of mindfulness that lead to enlightenment - healthy body, caring heart, intelligent mind and enlightened spirit. 

I use the term intrinsic quality, we (all) have it, but we need to learn the Middle Way Education wisdom to harness our body, heart, mind, spirit to be wholesome. It's good for ourselves, family and the world. 

[26:38] Jennifer: Now, with meditation as your main approach to “world peace through inner peace,” how can we really solve the current societal challenges? We have war and violence, we've got social divisiveness on and off the Internet, we've got refugee crises all over the world and climate change. How can we really solve that through daily meditation? I mean, climate change is not going to go away. 

[27:05] Monk: Yeah, I understand. 

[27:06] Jennifer: The war in Ukraine may not stop… 

[27:09] Monk: I think there’s a quote from the Dalai Lama, he said, if all six-year old students around the world will meditate today, we can end violence in one generation. So if you ask me, can we do it? Can, but we need to be super creative. 

I want to share one experience that (was) very moving for me. In 2014, we had a big event in the Philippines, and we make the largest flaming image in the world. And that time, we created the image with (candles) in the size of four football stadiums. Yeah, you imagine Super Bowl - four like that. And then about 50,000 people in the field, within 15 minutes, they light their own candle, they pass on to the next one, and then the whole field comes up with the largest image in the world that says “World Peace Through Inner Peace.”

[28:08] Jennifer: Yeah. So one person lit a candle, and they passed the candle, onto the person next to them. So in 15 minutes, all 50,000 people. 

[28:17] Monk: Yeah, it's all complete. 

[28:18] Jennifer: Amazing. 

[28:19] Monk: So let's imagine we have World Peace Fever - we have World Cup Fever. that is the only game that 1.4 billion people watch it at the same time. 

If we can cooperate around the world, I just dream about it, that (in) 2030, the year that (the) SDGs will be completed. If we can have 1 billion people meditate together on that day to celebrate SDG, maybe no more war after that. 1 billion people strong - no more war, no more. I think it will change. 

[28:54] Jennifer: Well, you’ve got seven years, Monk Burin. Seven years, that’s a lot of time - that’s exactly how long it takes to attain enlightenment. 

[29:03] Monk: Yeah, Buddha took around that time for enlightenment. So, why not? 

[29:06] Jennifer: From now to 2030, we’ve got seven years to attain… That's for the slowest person, so we need to start today. 

[29:13] Monk: I hope it's clear, it’s possible, but we need to be super joyful, super creative and make the whole world excited like World Cup Fever, but we have World Peace Fever. 

[29:26] Jennifer: Well, we're going to have to find a full moon in 2030 then. One thing I wanted to do is a short meditation, the Daily Mind Shower. Because everyday, it's on Facebook at 8a.m. Eastern standard time. Can you tell us, what is the Daily Mind Shower and why do we need it? 

[29:45] Monk: Yes, the Daily Mind Shower is the online meditation program on the Facebook page of MMI. It started amid the crisis in April 2020, when COVID-19 hit the world. And my students cannot come (to) see me, they ask me, can you teach online? So it (has) become a daily place of refuge. 

We come together, have a moment to learn meditation together, share how they practice and learn some wisdom to live that spirit during the day. So that is called Daily Mind Shower. It's a simple technique that we use every day, simple - no incense, no chanting, just two basic things. The first one (is) comfort - make yourself comfortable, on a chair, on the sofa, anywhere, move your body a bit, make sure that it's not tense or tight.

And the second thing is consciousness - feel conscious with your body, with your breathing and then conscious at your center of the body. And then take a shower and let the water of peace, the water of calmness run through - allow that intrinsic quality (that is) already there, just allow it to come. 

[31:01] Jennifer: And also maybe tell us how to meditate properly - where is the center of the body? You had mentioned it’s two fingers above the navel and I think the fingers have to be a certain way as well.

[31:10] Monk: Good, when I guide you to take a deep breath, you breathe in deeply into your stomach, then you feel the turning point up to your nose. That turning point is in the middle of your stomach, two finger width above the navel, that is (the) center of the body. 

But when you meditate, (do) not try too hard, take it easy around your stomach, and palms up on your laps comfortably, right hand over left hand, with the right index finger touching the left thumb. 

That is the Middle Way meditation position. (I) think we can start now, maybe 5-10 minutes. 

[31:49] Jennifer: 5-10 minutes, yep. 

[31:50] Monk: So from this moment, let's enjoy (the) mind shower together. Allow this beautiful moment of peace, calmness and serenity (to) come to your beings. Adjust your sitting position and gently close your eyes, soft, gentle and easy - softly close your eyes, with your hand palms up on your lap, the right finger touching the left thumb. 

Feel at ease in your body and take a deep breath if you like. Breathe in deeply into your stomach and breathe out slowly through your nose and mouth. In and out, in and out, slowly and gently. Every time that you breathe in, breathe in peace, joy and happiness. When you breathe out, breathe out all concerns, worries and tension - breathe out. 

In and out, in and out, slowly and gently. With a deep breathing, you can feel more relieved, feel more relaxed and allow gentle awareness (to) settle down inside yourself.

And you can now breathe as normal - do not worry about your breath anymore. Let your breath flow naturally and allow relaxing energy from your breathing, expand throughout your body. Calm, peaceful and gentle. Easy, simple and relaxed. 

When you feel your body, your mind more peaceful and gentle, then feel like your body turns crystallized, transparent, crystallized body and air can pass through. Light and gentle, easy and simple - seem like your body is melting away to your surroundings. No wall, no ceiling, just you and nature, with the sky, with the mountain, with the trees blending to nature.

And allow your awareness (to) settle down inside yourself, around a bit apart in your stomach, peaceful and gentle. At your center of the body, gently touch your center, like when you see the feathers on the bird floating down from the sky, touch the surface of the water. You can feel that gentle touch, and feel the ripples, the ripples of peace, ripples of love, spreading out - peaceful and gentle at your center. 

And set yourself free from anything, anyone, any thought, any ideas come - just let them fly away like a bird in the sky. Enjoy yourself on the top of the mountain, on a nice beach by the ocean. And let your mind have a shower with peace, with kindness, with love. 

Please continue meditating in silence for a moment. 

(pause)

To remain calm, peaceful and gentle inside yourself. And allow peace, loving energy rising from your silent mind. Allow your whole body, peaceful and gentle. And let this pure awareness be with you throughout the day until you go to bed tonight. 

(Monk chant in Pali)

You can slowly and gently open your eyes, still remain calm and peaceful inside yourself. 

[42:30] Jennifer: Sadhu (“very good” in Pali).

[42:31] Monk: Sadhu. 

[42:33] Jennifer: We're soon coming to an end of this episode. Monk Burin, please tell us, what are your favorite books over the years? 

[42:42] Monk: I have several, but the one that I recommend for anyone who wants to know more is the book called “What Buddhists Believe” by Venerable K. Sri Dhammananda, a classical explanation of Buddhism in the modern day, and (it) really showed me how I could explain Buddhism to help more people around the world. So I highly recommend this interesting book. 

[43:13] Jennifer: So for people who are just beginning to meditate, they can read this book and learn about Buddhism. What advice would you give to people who are beginner meditators? Besides coming to your Daily Mind Shower, what else can people do? 

[43:32] Monk: It’s simple, it's not difficult - we just get ourselves used to it and then it becomes natural. 

So first thing first, if you really want to have some benefit from meditation, shower your body, shower your mind, and do not touch your phone if you don't have a moment of peace of mind. I practice this habit - before I go to bed, I do airplane mode (on) my phone; and then in the morning, I would shower the body, shower the mind first, and when I have peace of mind, I will turn it back (on). 

Start with this one - first thing first - you can do five minutes, ten minutes, make sure that it's consistent. Like you shower your body every day, you shower your mind every day. More questions, we can talk, we have many resources around the world. 

[44:20] Jennifer: I have a feeling I'm going to be one of these people that takes seven years.

[44:23] Monk: No (chuckles). The key thing in practice is that we enjoy the journey, we don't look at the end too much. So it might be seven days, it might be seven months, seven years, we don't know. But let's enjoy it now. 

[44:39] Jennifer: And where can people find you and MMI online? 

[44:43] Monk: The main website is mmipeace.org. If you Google Monk Burin, you (will) find different guided meditation talks, even the one at Harvard Business School. 

[44:56] Jennifer: And also, there's a video with you and Professor Jeffrey Sachs. 

[45:00] Monk: Yeah, Wisdom and Sustainable Development - that's the name. The talk is about 1 hour, very interesting, how ancient wisdom will meet the future challenge. 

[45:10] Jennifer: One other thing that I want to mention - Middle Way Meditation Institute is still running retreats in Thailand. In fact, I think you have one retreat right now in Chiang Mai, and then the next one will be in December. 

[45:24] Monk: Yeah, a seven-day retreat. 

[45:26] Jennifer: It's not going to take me seven days, I can tell you, it'd be seven months or seven years. 

[45:29] Monk: No expectation, just enjoy it.

[45:32] Jennifer: No expectations. Last but not least, what does the Founder Spirit mean to you? 

[45:37] Monk: I feel strongly connected to the Buddha nature within, this (is) Founder Spirit. So if we can practice following good teaching and go to that Founder Spirit of ourselves, of who we are really, and what we (are) supposed to do in this life, that might be a great discovery of your Founder Spirit. 

[46:03] Jennifer: That's wonderful. Actually, Buddha had the Founder Spirit, but we could all have the Founder Spirit, if we can find the…

[46:12] Monk: We are all - that is the inner sun that shines for all. Buddha discovered that and then he said, yes, you have it. So we can be on that enlightened track following the Buddha also.

[46:24] Jennifer: We're now coming to the end of our interview. And as you know, we end every episode with a quote. And for this episode, we have a quote from Alan Turing, (an English mathematician, computer scientist and cryptanalyst.)

“Sometimes it's the people no one imagines anything of who do the things that no one can imagine.”

Venerable Monk Burin, many thanks for coming on the podcast today and showing us how to live the middle way in life. 

[46:55] Monk: Sadhu, rejoice in your wonderful work, Jennifer Wu, keep your spirit shine, enlightened spirit is coming. Thank you, so happy to be here. 

[47:06] Jennifer: If you find this podcast series beneficial or valuable, feel free to become a patron and support us on Patreon.com - that is P-A-T-R-E-O-N.com/TheFounderSpirit. 

The Founder Spirit podcast is a partner of the Villars Institute, a non-profit foundation focused on accelerating the transition to a net-zero economy and restoring planetary health. 

[47:32] END OF AUDIO